Updates from September, 2009 Toggle Comment Threads | Keyboard Shortcuts

  • Andrew Ozz 3:59 am on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: ,   

    Image Editor 

    The “first run” of a simple image editor has been in WordPress 2.9-rare for about two weeks. It lets the user crop, flip and rotate an image. It also has an option to scale the original (largest) image and to restore the originally uploaded version. There is a multi-step undo and redo support. Changes can be applied to all image sizes or only the thumbnail. The initial code is by Stephan Reiter author of the Scissors plugin.

    Currently when saving an edited image all previous intermediate image sizes are kept and the meta data for them (filename, width, height) is moved to another postmeta field. This is necessary to avoid breaking any posts or pages where the image was inserted. The editing workflow (multi-undo, preview of each step) makes it unnecessary to edit an image more than once or twice, however if an image is edited 6-7 times the backup files would be 25-30.

    There are couple of ways to avoid keeping unnecessary images, we could either track when an image was used in a post or a page, or we could have “standard” names for the intermediate image sizes. Tracking image use can be somehow problematic considering all the different ways content can be published in WordPress.

    Renaming the resized images from [imagename]-150×100 to [imagename]-thumbnail, etc. seems the more viable option. This would also bring instant image updates in already published posts, however may also have some compatibility problems with plugins that expect the image size to be part of the filename.

    Trac ticket for the image editor, suggestions and patches welcome :)

     
    • Alex (Viper007Bond) 5:02 am on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      You could also just use a shortcode for the image tag, although that may not be as user friendly. Then again, if you move domains, URLs, etc. you wouldn’t have to edit the post.

      So instead of this:

      <img src="http://blog.com/wp-content/uploads/imagename-thumbnail.jpg" width="150" height="100" title="Cool image" alt="ohai" />

      You’d do this:

      [image id="123" size="thumbnail" title="Cool image" alt="ohai"]

      The URL, width, and height would all be dynamic and change if you changed the thumbnail size, etc. This is opposite of now where even if the filename didn’t contain the dimensions, you’re still left with hard coded width/height parameters in the image tag.

      • scribu 11:49 am on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        That would be nice. And it’s been requested several times in the past.

      • Xavier 4:47 pm on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        • Beau 9:30 pm on September 26, 2009 Permalink

          Since both uploads would have a unique id in the DB, it doesn’t matter if they have the same filename. The correct URL would be output dynamically, based on wherever it was stored (as referenced by the DB)

      • Andrew Ozz 12:57 am on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Think this came up when we were doing the captions shortcodes a year ago and was rejected. Perhaps we can look at the pro & con again. Since all movies and other embeds will be handled by shortcodes it may make sense to extend that to include images too.

        However I see a possible problem with that. The img tag doesn’t need any processing on display but a shortcode would need quite a lot as it seems we will have to do get_post() for the attachment. Also our shortcode parsing code/API doesn’t seem optimized enough to handle large quantity of shortcodes.

        • aarondcampbell 8:20 pm on October 3, 2009 Permalink

          It is true that it can’t handle really large posts with lots of shortcodes. However, that’s definitely only affecting a very small percentage of people (if we’re really focusing on the 80-20 principle, it’s less than 20%). Do we really think that enough people will be writing stuff this long (and putting enough shortcodes in it) that we should worry about it? (That’s the post where I first ran into the issue…I tried to explain that it was just too long, but apparently it’s quite effective as it is).

          I like the shortcode idea.

        • Andrew Ozz 2:31 am on October 5, 2009 Permalink

          True, this is very rare at the moment but turning img tags into shortcodes would increase that number, perhaps a lot.

          No, don’t think we can apply the 80/20 principle here. Would that mean we can break up to 20% of all published posts? :)

          The problem is that even a shorter post with a lot of images will reach the backtrack limit or be very slow to display.

        • DD32 2:58 am on October 5, 2009 Permalink

          > or be very slow to display.

          Reminds me of the mention of storing filtered post contents along side the raw and serving those up instead of applying the expensive filters every load..

        • Andrew Ozz 3:19 am on October 5, 2009 Permalink

          Yes, post_content_filtered is still in the posts table. Think there are few plugins that do this, not sure how well though as it bypasses all ‘post_content’ filters.

        • Alex (Viper007Bond) 3:38 am on October 5, 2009 Permalink

          Perhaps storing a partially cached version would be best, i.e. just internal shortcodes. You’d break a lot of plugins if you rendered the entire content from a cached copy.

      • Jonathan Dingman 9:22 pm on October 1, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Would that imply dynamic resizing?

        ie, if someone changed the thumbnail size after already uploading the image, would it resize on the fly? (if specifying a thumbnail in the shortcode)

      • Denis de Bernardy 11:14 pm on October 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Using a shortcode here would hammer the DB unless it’s properly implemented.

        And this “it hammers the database”, btw, is the reason I had opened:

        http://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/10882

        I use similar code in two plugins of mine, and since you can’t rely on an attachment from being tied to a single post, I check for a post meta to make sure there are attachments (and which ones) before tossing a query.

      • Alex (Viper007Bond) 6:56 am on October 4, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        We also have to not forget about those who use TinyMCE and expect to see the image as is. A shortcode would be there as text.

        Perhaps a TinyMCE plugin could AJAX fetch the image (based on ID) and replace the shortcode with the image during editing, then put it back to the shortcode on save. That way it’d still stay a WYSIWYG.

        • aarondcampbell 9:53 pm on October 4, 2009 Permalink

          That’s a good point. It’s easy to forget about those using WYSIWYG

    • Barış Ünver 6:33 am on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      I’m concerned about the fact that WordPress is getting fatter and fatter each version. Is it really necessary? Couldn’t it be done with a plugin or something?

      Or at least, are we gonna be able to se a lighter (official) version of WordPress? LitePress v2.9.0 maybe?

      • Alex (Viper007Bond) 9:14 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Filesize (aka fat) is not directly related to performance. The image editor for example has literally zero (no joke on the literally) impact on the front page of your site for example as it’s never loaded except in the admin area.

        • Andrew Ozz 12:15 am on October 1, 2009 Permalink

          On top of that even in the admin it’s only loaded through AJAX so it doesn’t add any overhead anywhere.

      • aarondcampbell 8:22 pm on October 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        It’s all about the 80-20 rule. I think more than 80% of the people will use this on a regular basis. I probably won’t, but most of my clients will. I’m all for keeping code as lean as possible, but I’m also all for adding this support in. Let’s trim in other areas. Just my 2 cents.

    • Andrew Ozz 1:37 am on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Another solution for the multiple image backup files would be to let the user decide. We can include a checkbox whether to delete the previously edited image (together with all sub-sizes). Since the suffix that is appended to the image filename contains a timestamp, we could do something like “This image was last edited 1 hour ago. If it wasn’t used in a Post since then you can remove the backup files by selecting this checkbox”.

      On the other hand even the cheapest hosting accounts seem to come with a lot of storage so deleting backups would be unnecessary. Also a plugin can add a simple GUI to search the db and return a list of unused backup images that can be deleted. Not sure if something like this would be good for core.

    • Otto 6:07 pm on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      I think the key to this problem is the following: “This is necessary to avoid breaking any posts or pages where the image was inserted.”

      Why avoid breaking those posts/pages? If somebody edits an image, then change the image itself. That’s what they will probably expect to happen.

      Having to have them go and reinsert the changed image into the page/post is confusing and unnecessary. We don’t need to save the original. The user uploaded the image, presumably they have the original. An in-place editor should simply overwrite the existing files with the new ones, not try to preserve them.

      • Andrew Ozz 12:30 am on October 1, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        True, users that know what they’re doing may expect to break old posts when editing an image. However the majority will most likely complain that “the image editor breaks all old posts!”.

        Also we cannot just replace the originally used image with the edited one as images are inserted with “width” and “height” attribs that in most cases will distort the edited image (as Viper007Bond pointed above).

  • Peter Westwood 9:46 pm on September 24, 2009 Permalink | Reply
    Tags:   

    Suggest agenda items for Oct 1st dev chat

     
    • Beau 9:25 pm on September 26, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Apparently SimplePie development is ceasing. This will (eventually) impact WordPress if someone doen’t keep SP alive somehow. Perhaps we want to be involved in that?

      • Jeffro 9:13 pm on September 27, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Interesting development considering Magpie support in WordPress was being phased out due to the lack of development in favor if SimplePie.

        • Matt 9:14 pm on September 27, 2009 Permalink

          WordPress inclusion is kiss of death for RSS parsers.

        • Peter Westwood 9:17 pm on September 27, 2009 Permalink

          So which one should we choose to kill of next ;-)

          Anyone got any ideas!

        • Millan 2:36 pm on September 29, 2009 Permalink

          Automattic can take over development of SimplePie maybe. No reason to search for other and better parser.

      • Dion 11:06 pm on September 27, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        SimplePie will most likely live on, Ryan McCue has stated that he’ll attempt to keep bug-fixes up to date time-providing, And I’d be surprised if someone else doesn’t step up to continue development..

        Whilst i cant be sure since no-one knows.. I don’t see SP rotting away to nothing in the near future, Worst case scenario is that some WordPress folk might have to occasionally patch some bugs here or there, or add some much needed support for a feed-type.. Given its pretty well written and pretty stable atm, Its probably not going to need much work in the near future, And when(if) it does start dying, there’ll be another project poping up which will supersede it anyway..

      • Otto 6:03 pm on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Oh, that’s just lovely…

        Well, SimplePie is used enough that somebody will probably pick it up and continue making improvements. However, if that doesn’t happen for a while, then we can just leave it be. It’s not really critical functionality, RSS and ATOM feed structures don’t change a whole heck of a lot anymore.

        So, my vote is to just stick with the latest SimplePie, roll in security patches (if there are any), and other than that pretty much just leave it alone until some other project becomes the defacto.

        Then we kill that one too. :D

      • nanochrome 8:42 pm on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Automattic should fork it and make it rsspress. :)

      • Andreas Nurbo 8:57 pm on September 28, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        I’d say you stick with SimplePie. I don’t think there are any good alternatives really. Github is really good for this kind of stuff so you might as well do a wp fork if hehe.

      • Ryan McCue 4:26 am on September 29, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        As one of the (ex) developers of SimplePie, I’ve started a fork at http://github.com/rmccue/SimplePie

        I’ve fixed 2 bugs which might have been major for some people, as Geoffrey pointed out to me, and I’m in the process of transferring all the open bugs over to GitHub’s issue tracker.

        That said, I don’t have a lot of time, so I’d appreciate any help.

        I’m hopeful that I might be able to get the SP domain name from Ryan Parman in order to continue development, but I don’t currently have the money to renew the domain if needed, and my hosting would die if I hosted the site on my server.

        • Matt 7:04 am on September 29, 2009 Permalink

          I’m happy to donate domain registration and free hosting.

        • Ryan McCue 9:39 am on September 29, 2009 Permalink

          Thanks Matt. I’ve sent an email to Ryan Parman about maintaining the project officially.

        • Ryan Parman 5:09 pm on September 29, 2009 Permalink

          I’d be happy to donate the domain name whomever wants to take over development. SimplePie is currently integrated into WordPress, Joomla, MODx, SilverStripe, DokuWiki, and a ton of other third-party projects. In an ideal world, I’d love to see at least a small investment of engineering resources from each of these projects toward giving SimplePie a future beyond Geoffrey and I.

          If there’s any interest in this, please let me know. A few other folks have expressed interest in getting involved, but there’s needs to be a “point man” to maintain the long-term vision for SimplePie and coordinate efforts.

          Ryan M. has stepped up, but he’s said he doesn’t have a lot of time. If anybody else has the time or resources to invest, please let me know so that we can put a plan together over the next few days/weeks.

        • Ryan McCue 12:47 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink

          Matt, I’ve sent you an email regarding this.

    • sc0ttkclark 5:17 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      How about a discussion about what WP / Automattic can do to make the Plugin Repository more secure, and help prevent insecure plugins from being installed? The bar seems like it’s been lowered far enough now that you can Add plugins directly from your self hosted WordPress site in a few clicks.

      Whether is a solution going forward, or a retroactive solution, some sort of plans should probably be discussed.

      • Matt 7:41 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Yes, I’d like to talk about a group of community members who could give plugins a once over before it is allowed to be added to the repo. See http://www.wptavern.com/is-a-plugin-validation-team-a-pipe-dream

        This would also make sure that people couldn’t request hosting without intention of hosting on wp.org but for use as a placeholder, which I know developers who sell plugins do.

        • Jonathan 7:44 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink

          +1

          also to discuss linking methods within description, installation, FAQ, and help pages for the plugins.

          NOTE: to talk about how external links are handled

      • Jeffro 8:01 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        I have a feeling that a topic like this could easily take up the entire hour and would probably be best discussed as an entirely separate meeting. But worth a shot.

    • Denis 7:05 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      http://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/10882

      Your patch to the bug you “fixed” the other day breaks quite a few of my plugins, and I fail to see why Andrew’s patch isn’t worth committing on the spot.

    • demetris 8:51 pm on September 30, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      I’d like to propose for discussion the idea of a page (in the admin area, or in wp.org or in both) that credits all third-party projects used in WordPress. I think it’s something lacking from WordPress and it would be a nice gesture of acknowledgment to those whose work benefits WordPress. If other people like the idea, I’m willing to do the work for this.

      There is a also the issue of properly crediting individual contributors to individual releases, but I think this should be a separate discussion, maybe in the context of trying to generally improve WP release notes.

      Something else I was thinking about was a way to track compatibility of at least some prominent, popular plugins (and maybe themes?) with upcoming versions of WP. — This could be a resource maintained by a few users of pre-beta development versions of WP and it could help plugin authors to find out about issues with enough time to work on them.

      I’ve made a spreadsheet in Google Docs to help me visualize the idea and to see whether this could be done in a simple, easy way:

      http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AhDAjUtXxC-5cnN6Nk1odEdkU0tMcDdWdWMza0FKTFE

      Cheers!

    • Matt 8:30 pm on October 1, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      As suggest by Jane I am adding IRC Ops to the discussion again, perhaps as more of a task than a discussion.

  • Jane Wells 8:58 pm on September 24, 2009 Permalink | Reply  

    September 24 dev chat agenda:
    -Plugin directory policies
    -Any core code questions that people need answered to help them finish a patch against 2.9

     
  • Peter Westwood 3:55 pm on September 19, 2009 Permalink | Reply
    Tags:   

    Suggest agenda items for Sept 24th dev chat.

     
    • Jane Wells 4:51 pm on September 19, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Excellent project management, @westi! :)

    • Mark Jaquith 11:28 pm on September 21, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Discussion of Plugin Directory policies regarding plugins that insert SERPs-influencing links into the public blog. Touch on: paid SEO links, author SEO links, author credit links.

      • Dougal 3:03 pm on September 23, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        What’s the difference between “author SEO links” and “author credit links”?

      • Mark Jaquith 8:02 pm on September 24, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Grr, I’m probably not going to be able to make it this week. Can we push this topic back until next week?

    • sc0ttkclark 3:20 pm on September 22, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      What’s the WordPress official stance on plugins with “WP” or “WordPress” in the name?

      • sc0ttkclark 3:28 pm on September 22, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        [09/22/2009 - 10:24 AM] WP is ok, WordPress is not
        [09/22/2009 - 10:24 AM] what about “Blah Blah for WordPress”
        [09/22/2009 - 10:25 AM] should avoid using wordpress in a URL or proper name for trademark reasons

        • sc0ttkclark 2:19 pm on September 26, 2009 Permalink

          The usernames got mashed at some point during the copy / paste, so this was a 2 way conversation LOL

      • Mark Jaquith 8:03 pm on September 24, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Will need @photomatt present for this one, as Automattic is the guardian of the trademark.

      • Matt 11:46 pm on September 24, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        I can answer here, we ask people not use WordPress in their domain:

        http://wordpress.org/about/domains/

        WP is okay everywhere and for everything. As for WordPress in the name — personally I think it’s redundant (it’s a WP plugin already) but the main thing is that it’s not confusing to consumers.

        • sc0ttkclark 2:19 pm on September 26, 2009 Permalink

          Great, thanks for the clarification!

  • Jane Wells 1:41 am on September 11, 2009 Permalink | Reply  

    Suggest agenda items for Sept 17 dev chat.

     
    • Jane Wells 1:43 am on September 11, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Check in on status of the media features that we haven’t talked about in a couple of weeks.
      -Basic image editing (Azaozz)
      -Gallery improvements/Photo Albums (I’m still not super clear on which way we decided to go with this)
      -Embeds (Viper007Bond)
      -UI update (Jane)

      • Alex (Viper007Bond) 1:51 am on September 11, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        The embeds framework has been mostly done for a week or so. It should probably be committed for further testing and other handlers be written (VideoPress for example).

        • Alex (Viper007Bond) 2:13 am on September 11, 2009 Permalink

          Actually, let me get the phpdoc and some other minor tweaks in first. Might as well get it done right the first time rather than adding more stuff in later.

    • Matt 6:19 pm on September 17, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      OPs for the #wordpress IRC channel.

    • Peter Westwood 8:23 pm on September 17, 2009 Permalink | Reply

  • Jane Wells 2:57 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply  

    Topic suggestion for Sept 10 chat?

     
    • Jeffro 3:38 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      I’d like to know if we could talk about the way releases are handled on the development blog. Taking a look at posts in the past regarding releases, the display of information, links to changesets or the lack thereof are all over the map. I think it would be beneficial for the team to share a template to use for Release type posts on the dev blog.

      One other thing I wanted to know. Why is it that typically, to upgrade WordPress you need to upload the entire package even if just a few files were changed? For those folks where auto upgrade does not work and they do not want to wait for 20 minutes to upload the WordPress package, is it safe to just upload the changed files to perform the upgrade? This ties into my first discussion point.

      • Jane Wells 3:46 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        “To share a template to use for Release type posts on the dev blog” implies that there’s a template to share, which there isn’t. :) Announcement posts are written individually and tend to vary in style based on what kind of release it is and who’s writing it. Matt’s posts are chatty and highlight the headline features, Ryan’s posts are practically haikus that link to the .zip, etc. I agree it would be good to have a set of information that is included each time, though, for whichever author to check against. Not sure if this needs to be a discussion point in the chat, though… might make more sense to put together a list of items to include, post it here, and invite feedback, especially since all the announcement authors won’t be in the chat today.

        There have been past releases where the announcement says you can just upload/overwrite specific files.

        • Dougal Campbell 3:09 pm on September 11, 2009 Permalink

          I’m still drafting out a blog post with many ideas for improving (I hope) community information and such. But just a quick note of what I think about regarding a “template” for releases:

          In each new feature release, there are changes in core along these lines:

          • new functions added
          • existing functions modified (new arguments? return type changed? side-effects?)
          • existing functions deprecated
          • deprecated functions removed

          And where I say “functions” you could also substitute “classes”, “files”, “action/filter hooks”, and “global variables”, really. Fortunately, the first item is most common, and the other three cases are relatively infrequent.

          In order to help the third-party plugin/theme development community stay up-to-date with changes in core, I think it is very important that these changes are documented in a standard fashion. Currently, we pretty much just have to keep our eye on changes in the SVN repo and/or Trac, and hope that we don’t miss something important. I’d like to us to have a known place where one could see these sorts of internal technical changes detailed in a formal way.

          Is there a way to automate it? I don’t know if there’s an existing tool for it, but at least some of it *could* be automated. It shouldn’t be hard to automate detection of new functions, classes, and files. And deprecation tagging should be easy, too. Detecting changes to existing functions could at least be partially automated, if it’s something obvious that affects the @param or @return tags in the phpdoc. Other changes (like a new global variable related to a new feature) might have to be documented manually. And of course, when I say that automating some of these things should be “easy”, I mean compared to trying to track them by hand and write it all up at release-time. :)

          BTW, I wish I could participate in the dev IRC chats, but they take place right around the time that I’m trying to wrap up work and get ready to head home, and my family is a higher priority :)

      • scribu 5:19 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        For the second part, there was some discussion on downloading only changed files. Not sure if there’s a ticket on trac for it though.

      • Mark Jaquith 8:20 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        There’s a way to do this in Trac, but it’s not immediately obvious. I can share in the chat.

      • Dougal Campbell 8:53 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        It’s fine that various people do their own writeups about releases in their own style.

        But I think that there could be some value to codifying/formalizing some sort of “official announcement style”, even if it is posted separately (Codex?), and merely referenced in the other announcments.

        This is something I’ve been kicking around in the back of my brain for some time now, and there are hints of it in the postings I’ve made recently on wp-hackers, my own site, and in comments elsewhere, regarding the recent worm incident. I’m working on another blog post about it now.

        This isn’t the place for a lengthy discussion about it, however. After I finish putting my thoughts down, I’ll post a note about it on wp-hackers, and I’d like to see some more discussion there about the pros/cons/costs/benefits of formalizing some release procedures and information.

        • Jeffro 9:04 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink

          Ok, guess I should get on the ball and rejoin the hackers mailing list.

    • scribu 8:01 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      What’s happening with the GSOP projects? MPTT and the Search API especially.

      • Alex (Viper007Bond) 8:02 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Search: http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/search/

        Been using it on my blog for a while. Works great.

      • Jane Wells 8:14 pm on September 10, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        I’m getting updates on integration from all the GSoC mentors, but doubt I’ll have them all by today’s meeting. When they all come in, there’ll be a summary post on the dev blog. Held off on posting about it so we could say what was happening with each one (as opposed to just saying they were finished).

  • Jane Wells 8:33 pm on September 1, 2009 Permalink | Reply  

    Suggest topics for the September 3rd dev chat.

     
    • Jane Wells 8:33 pm on September 1, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Status check on the various features people said they’d work on for 2.9. Will dig up the list from chat a month and a half ago, hoping there’s been some progress.

    • Denis de Bernardy 4:50 pm on September 2, 2009 Permalink | Reply

    • Jane Wells 9:14 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

      Yoast working (and discussing with westi) on allowing login and register pages to be templated

      • Matt 9:15 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        Meaning — CSS?

        • Peter Westwood 9:18 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink

          No meaning as a template file like login.php
          So you can completely intergrate the login into your CMS
          With possibly other stuff on the page as well

        • Matt 9:25 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink

          I think we lose a lot of flexibility in future updates to the login system if we allow the login logic to be overwritten, I’ve seen numerous full integrations done using just CSS though. It’s trivial to change colors, replace logos, etc. It’s what CSS was designed to do.

        • Matt 9:26 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink

          I would be okay with a wp_login_form() template tag that could be embedded other places, though.

        • Peter Westwood 9:31 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink

          Trying to understand what we would lose with the following:
          Refactor current login code to be template tag able
          Allow a theme to completely change html using a login.php template file
          Add pretty permalink support for the wp-login.php page.

          As long as the themes are using the template tags we use in the default we have the same flexibility?

      • Jane Wells 9:16 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

        It’s being discussed right now in dev chat, just adding it here so will remember to include for post-meeting post.

    • Jane Wells 10:01 pm on September 3, 2009 Permalink | Reply

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